In this episode, Port Blakely’s newly installed CEO Mike Warjone and his cousin, Chairman and outgoing CEO René Ancinas, discuss the carefully planned leadership transition at the company that became official at the end of 2025.
This episode also features part 2 of our conversation with fifth-generation co-presidents Jeannie Cullen Schultz and George Cullen of JP Cullen, who explain how a “field-first” mindset, people-centered leadership and clear expectations across the 133-year-old construction business have helped preserve the company’s culture and values as it has scaled.
Also in this episode, Pat Soldano, president of Family Enterprise USA and a contributing author to Family Business Magazine, makes a compelling case for why family business owners must advocate for themselves with lawmakers.
Interested in being a guest or have a topic you’d like to hear us discuss? Contact host Zack Needles, editor-in-chief of Family Business Magazine, at: zneedles@familybusinessmagazine.com.
Don’t miss an episode! Follow Family Business/Business Family on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, Amazon Music or wherever you listen to podcasts.
Guests
Mike Warjone
Mike Warjone is Chief Executive Officer of Port Blakely, leading enterprise-wide strategy and operations across the company’s forestry businesses in the United States and New Zealand. With nearly 30 years at Port Blakely, he has played a central role in advancing climate-smart forestry, natural climate solutions, and long-term growth. A fourth-generation descendant of the company’s founders, Mike brings deep operational expertise and a stewardship-focused perspective to the company’s future.
René Ancinas
René Ancinas is Chairman and immediate past CEO of Port Blakely Companies. Prior to joining Port Blakely Companies, he was founding member and first pesident of the Eddy Family Council, where he led a five-year effort to establish a sustainable family business governance structure.
Jeannie Cullen Schultz
Jeannie Cullen Schultz is also a Shareholder and Co-President of the family business, JP Cullen. Jeannie attended Dartmouth College as a student-athlete, playing basketball and initially planning a career in coaching. Her path shifted when she decided to join the family business—a move that required proving herself outside the company first. She worked as a project manager for HVAC contractor North American Mechanical before earning two master’s degrees from the University of Wisconsin, including one in construction management. Since joining JP Cullen in 2012, Jeannie has driven significant growth in the healthcare market in Dane County, building relationships with nearly every hospital in Madison and expanding the company’s healthcare client base by 92%. She is deeply involved in her community, serving on nonprofit boards and steering committees, and is passionate about encouraging women to pursue careers in construction. Jeannie and her husband share a love of sports with their five children, especially cheering on Badger basketball and football.
George Cullen
George Cullen is Shareholder and Co-President of JP Cullen, a fifth-generation, family-owned construction firm founded in 1892. Alongside his sister, Jeannie, they lead an 850+ person team across three Wisconsin offices, delivering complex projects for clients nationwide. He drives corporate strategy, guides the executive leadership team, and oversees three of the company’s five divisions as well as four of its seven business support groups. George earned his bachelor’s degree in finance and management from Georgetown University, where he played collegiate football, and later completed a master’s degree in construction management at the University of Wisconsin. As is the requirement before joining JP Cullen as a family member, George gained valuable experience at a large mechanical contractor in California, starting as an estimator and quickly becoming the company’s youngest Division Manager. At JP Cullen, George worked in the Industrial Division and later served as Vice President of Work Procurement, overseeing marketing and business development to secure negotiated work. He is also a dedicated servant to his community serving on various boards and committees mainly focused in Rock County. George and his wife reside in Madison with their three children.
Pat Soldano
Pat Soldano spent more than 30 years providing family office services as owner of Cymric Family Office Services, and then as Managing Director of Western Region for GenSpring for five years and then a Family Office Consultant.
Currently she is President of Family Enterprise USA; its mission is to promote the growth of generational owned family businesses in the US, and President of Policy and Taxation Group, which she formed in 1995, that works to reduce onerous tax and economic policies for successful families, family offices and family business.
Transcript
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And I think that it’s really important to the employees that work here, a lot of them
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that I’ve talked to about it, that the company is owned and managed by a family member.
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And that sort of generational approach to investment that we pride ourselves in that
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philosophy is largely enabled and underwritten by the fact that you’ve got a family member
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at the top.
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That was Mike Warjohn, a family member and 28-year veteran of sixth-generation
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forestry company, Port Blakely, who took over as CEO on December 31st.
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In this episode, I talk with Warjohn and his cousin, Port Blakely’s chairman and outgoing
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CEO, Rene Ancinis.
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They discussed the carefully planned leadership transition at the company.
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Happy New Year and welcome to the Family Business Business Family Podcast.
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I’m Zach Needles, editor-in-chief of Family Business Magazine.
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This episode also features part two of my conversation with fifth-generation
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co-presidents, Jeanne Collin-Schultz and her brother, George Collin of J.P.
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Collin. The 133-year-old construction firm has grown into a nearly 1,000-person
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enterprise while maintaining a deep respect for the people in the field.
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But first, I’m joined by Pat Soldano, president of Family Enterprise USA and a
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contributing author to Family Business Magazine, who makes a compelling case for
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why family business owners must become advocates for themselves.
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Pat walks through why policy engagement matters, how lawmakers actually want to
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hear from constituents, and what family enterprises can do practically and
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effectively to make their voices heard in Washington.
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Hi, Pat.
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Nice to see you as always.
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Welcome back to the podcast.
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Thanks, Zach.
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I’m really, really pleased to be asked to come back.
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Yeah, this is a great topic and obviously one that you’re an expert on.
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So it’s advocacy and why it’s important to be an advocate for your family
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business and for family businesses in general.
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And so let’s start there.
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Why is it important to advocate and does it really make a difference?
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It is so important to advocate because the tax laws in this country and all
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the legislation in this country is going to change.
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It’s the nature of our system.
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And so if you want to be part of the solution, you really have to be
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there and you have to be there in person.
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You have to be there continually and constantly.
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Our legislators are there to listen to you.
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And they really do want to hear what you’re experiencing in terms of your
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challenges or issues running your family businesses.
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And legislators change.
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You know, we have elections in the House every two years and in the
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Senate every six years.
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So there’s new people all the time.
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Perfect example is when this last bill passed, the one big beautiful bill in
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the House, only 25% of the people in the House of Representatives were
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actually around with the last tax bill.
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So they had no history of the legislation and they had to be educated.
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So it’s really, really important that you meet with your members of
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Congress and legislation does change.
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Our members of Congress say this legislation is permanent.
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Well, I can tell you as someone who’s worked Washington, D.C.
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and the Hill for 30 years, nothing is permanent.
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It’s permanent until the next Congress changes it.
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Absolutely.
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And, you know, I think even for family business owners who do understand
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how important advocacy is, a lot of them probably don’t know where to start.
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So how does a family business owner or even a single citizen who’s
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passionate about these issues reach out to lawmakers and where do
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they start in that process?
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Well, they first need to start with knowing who their legislators are.
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And they shouldn’t be embarrassed if they don’t know that.
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They can go to congress.gov and they can put in their zip code and they
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can find exactly who are their federal legislators.
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They need to then reach out to them.
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And there’s many ways you can do that.
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In today’s world, it’s an email.
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It’s a phone call to their district office and then to their D.C. office.
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You can go meet with them in their district office.
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If you have the opportunity to go to D.C., you should definitely make
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a meeting with the member or the staff.
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They really do want to see you and they love seeing constituents.
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So you should make the effort to do that.
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If you don’t have the time to do that, go locally to their town hall meetings.
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Go to a fundraiser.
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It means you have to write a check, but it means you’re in the room
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with the member of Congress.
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And if you go to the fundraiser, make sure that you actually talk
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to the member of Congress and their staff members.
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They’re there to listen to you.
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So during the reception time, make sure you go up to them.
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Be polite.
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But it’s not inappropriate to ask for a specific issue that you’re
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concerned about and a resolution to that issue.
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So again, I think sometimes people are intimidated by members of Congress
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and they absolutely should not be because they are there to listen
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and get to know their staff members, both at the district office
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as well as the national office, but all the other avenues.
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I wouldn’t advise a letter because the mail is very slow, especially
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in Washington, D.C., with all the security.
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Yeah, absolutely.
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And some great advice.
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And let’s say you do get a formal meeting with a representative
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or a member of their staff.
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How much time can you expect to spend with them?
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Since obviously we know these folks are busy.
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They are busy.
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They do a meeting sometimes every 15 minutes.
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So you can appreciate that they have very long days.
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They’re very busy in D.C.
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People in D.C. generally work very hard.
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They’re there because they want to make a difference.
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You know, sometimes they do and sometimes they don’t,
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but that’s why they’re there.
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So your meeting could last 10, 20 minutes, especially if it’s
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with a member of Congress.
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Sometimes they get interrupted.
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They get pulled away.
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You may have a meeting scheduled and it gets canceled because
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a vote may come up.
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That’s not their fault.
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They have to be there for votes.
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You shouldn’t take that personally.
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You also should understand, especially in the House, you’re
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probably not going to have a very fancy meeting room.
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You’re going to be meeting in the lobby if there’s not a,
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especially if it’s a freshman member of Congress, you’re not going
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to necessarily be meeting in a conference room and you may even
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be meeting in the hallway because that’s the only available space they have.
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So you just take advantage of that.
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It’s very, very important.
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That you are understanding of the situation.
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Usually all staff members, members of Congress, again, they want to see you.
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So they’ll do everything possible to spend that time with you.
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And as we mentioned, often in these meetings, you end up speaking
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with a staff member instead of the, the, the Congress person themselves.
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Is it just as good as meeting with an elected official or is
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that a waste of time for lack of a better way to put it?
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It’s definitely not a waste of time.
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It’s always great to try and meet with a member of Congress, but it’s hard
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to get those meetings, especially if you’re not a constituent, but
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the staff is very, very important.
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A member of Congress typically is not going to do something, sign
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on to a bill or specific legislation if it’s not supported by their staff.
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So you want to get to know the staff.
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Of course you want to meet with the member because ultimately
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the member has to make that decision.
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But I’ll tell you a perfect example.
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We’ve met with a member of Congress three times and he has yet to follow
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up with our ask because his staff in Washington, DC is short staffed.
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So they don’t have the resources right now to address our concerns.
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And so it’s not because the member doesn’t want to get on board.
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It’s because really the staff doesn’t have the resources.
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We’re hoping that’s going to change soon.
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So again, we’re working with the staff because it’s really, really
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important that they support what we’re trying to do.
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So they’re just as important with meeting with the members.
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So people shouldn’t discount that.
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And when it comes to reaching out, regardless of who you end up talking to,
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is it important to have a specific ask or is it okay to come in with
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kind of several more general issues of concern?
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It’s very important to be specific.
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And so if you get a meeting with a member or a staff member, the
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first thing is be prepared.
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Make sure you come with materials that you want to distribute.
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Make sure you know what you’re going to say in advance.
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If you go with a group, make sure there’s a leader in that group.
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You all go around the room very quickly and do your introductions.
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And then each of you say what your ask is.
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It’s really important because there doesn’t make sense to do these
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meetings if you’re not asking for something and again, be polite,
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be understanding they may or may not agree with your ask, but it’s
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appropriate to say, do you think this is a reasonable ask?
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Do you think your boss would accept this is something they would support?
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Get their input because again, the staff is important to the
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member of Congress. Leave a business card.
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It’s very important that they know who you are because they may
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want to see you in your district.
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So it’s really important to be organized.
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It’s really, really important to be brief, be succinct, be
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right, and then be gone.
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Yeah, I love that.
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And there’s so many great tips here already, but do you have any
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other best practices that come to mind for making your voice
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heard with lawmakers?
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Yeah, I think that it is, again, the most important thing is
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just to do it, even if it’s an email or it’s a response to
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social media.
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Many of the members of Congress now use social media and they’ll
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post about family businesses.
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So you want to like those.
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You want to respond to those.
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You want to connect with your members of Congress through
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social media, as well as through email.
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You also should check out their website and see if they have any
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events coming up that you could attend.
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That’s always really important.
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And it’s also critically important to follow up.
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If you do have the opportunity to meet with a member or a
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staff, make sure you follow up with an email or phone call and
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thank them, first of all, for the meeting.
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They need to be thanked.
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It’s a difficult job and they need to be appreciated.
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And then remind them what your ask is again and tell them
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that you’ll get back to them in two weeks.
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And really, if you have the time, you absolutely need to
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follow up.
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I will tell people that it takes more than one time.
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Unfortunately, that is our process, especially today.
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You really have to ask more than once.
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You have to continue to follow up because they have other
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things that they’re dealing with.
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And like all of us, it’s about priorities.
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So don’t be afraid to continue to reach out.
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Again, be polite to your member of Congress, your
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district office, or your national office.
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Yeah.
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And I really appreciate that you’ve emphasized this point of
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don’t be afraid, don’t be intimidated.
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These folks are there to listen to you.
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They’re elected officials for a reason and that’s their job.
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So I think that’s a really important thing to point out.
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And I would just mention for more on this topic, Pat’s
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latest column from the Hill is all about this, provides
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even more detail and more pointers on how to approach
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lawmakers.
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So that will be in our January, February, 2026 print
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issue.
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But if you can’t wait that long, it’s online now at
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familybusinessmagazine.com.
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So check that out, Pat.
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Always nice to see you and get your insights.
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And I really appreciate you talking about this issue
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because, you know, as I mentioned, I think a lot of
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people understand that it’s important to advocate, but
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they have no idea how to go about doing it.
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And it can be a little intimidating.
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So I appreciate your insights on this.
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Well, Zach, thank you so much for giving me this
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opportunity.
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Advocating is so critically important, no matter what
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your issue is.
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And I hope that family businesses understand that
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and make the effort because it is very important that
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their voices be heard.
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So thank you so much for the opportunity.
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In this segment, J.P.
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Cullen’s sibling co-leaders, Jeannie Cullen Schultz
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and George Cullen, explain how a field-first
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mindset, people-centered leadership and clear
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expectations across the organization have helped
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preserve the values the company was founded upon
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and which they continue to uphold today.
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So the company has often emphasized a field-first
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mindset, and I’m basing this off of something that
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I read somewhere else that your grandfather, I think,
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said, so tell me if he didn’t, but that basically
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the most important person in the company is the
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person swinging the hammer.
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And so how do you keep that legacy alive as the
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business grows?
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I think you mentioned, Jeannie, it’s 900 plus
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people in the business, right?
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So, and you have all these high-profile projects.
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How do you keep that, that legacy alive?
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Well, it’s something that we constantly think
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about and it’s intertwined in our mission
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statement, our vision statement, our values and
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our beliefs.
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So it’s always top of mind, but I know Jeannie
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would say the same thing for us.
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It was so modeled by the behaviors of our
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grandfather and our dad and our two uncles.
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Like I have a lot of memories coming to the
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fitness and going to get a, a Coke in the
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basement and coming back up and visiting with
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my grandpa for a little bit and men and women
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from the field would go by his office and he
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would know their name.
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That is intentional and it’s something that
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Jeannie and I spend time on is getting to
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know people’s names, getting to know
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people’s interests.
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And like when you go to the field, it’s not
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just, hi, I’m George.
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It’s, Hey, you, your kid’s a hockey player.
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Um, and just having those connections is just
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so important.
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Not only doing it because of the positive
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nature of the business, but we like to do it.
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Like we want to be connected with our team
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members and we learned that from, from
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there, but the reality is, is we’ve
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grown as a business.
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It’s no longer that Jeannie and I can be
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able to be that person for all of our
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900 employees.
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That’s not fair to them.
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It’s unrealistic for us.
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So we’ve intentionally built out our, what
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we call our senior management team.
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So those leaders, the expectation is clear.
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The number one priority of yours is
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people development and doing those
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intentional things that we know has made
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our business successful.
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Yeah.
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And then the last thing, and we’re very,
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I’m always sensitive to this because when
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we say in the most important person,
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swing that the most important person in
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company is one swinging the hammer.
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Well, that signals to a lot of other
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people than I’m not the most important
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person, but you have to explain the
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why and the why is our customers hire
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us to build buildings.
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They hire us to pour concrete, erect
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steel, lay block, and that is done
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by very skilled trades.
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So all of us that aren’t skilled
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trades people, we’re there to support
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those individuals.
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So if it’s a team member in IT, how
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do you ensure that trades person and a
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snap of the finger can pull up the
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plans on his phone?
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If it’s somebody in accounting who
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just had a huge job of ensuring
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everybody gets paid on time, direct
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deposit goes off seamlessly.
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If it’s us who are responsible
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for work procurement, we got to go
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win jobs that allow that person
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swinging the hammer to be successful.
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So it’s not just the person, but it
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is the aspect of what we do and
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what our customers pay us for.
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We say we honor the field.
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We honor that our customers need
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us to build their hospitals, build
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their schools, build their food
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production facilities, their power
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generation.
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So we all play a role in
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supporting that.
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Absolutely.
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And so here’s a, not a simple
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question, I guess, but a good
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one to kind of end on here.
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You know, how, how are you
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positioning JP Cullen to survive
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and thrive into the, the next
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generation and beyond while preserving
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those, those values that we were just
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talking about the culture we were
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just talking about, which is so
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important and, and this commitment
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to the, to your workforce and to
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the communities that you serve.
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Well, number one, uh, we have
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to follow the playbook that worked
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hard to us and ensure it’s still
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relevant to the type of company
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we are.
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And it’s already rattling around
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for me, like for our sixth
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generation, we all went and worked
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somewhere else, but I think it
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00:17:35.380 –> 00:17:36.600
would be even better to take that
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to that next step is work
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somewhere else, get a promotion,
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start to get some profit
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responsibility before you come
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to your family business, like
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really ratcheting up the
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intensity of the experience that
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they get outside of the
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business.
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Number two, we take so much
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pride in, we just did a survey
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of our employees and the number
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one that thing, the one and two
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thing that came through those
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00:18:01.300 –> 00:18:03.320
surveys is how much they love
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being an employee at a family
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owned company.
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And then number two, how much
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everybody is focused on people
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development.
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And to me, those things go
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hand in hand.
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So at a really young age,
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we’re going to be communicating
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to our sixth generation is
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companies bigger than you.
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It’s about the people in the
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business, uh, and that focus
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on people will allow them to be
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successful.
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And then the last thing, again,
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COVID had a lot of miserable
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things about it.
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But one of the interesting
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things was the whole essential
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versus non-essential business,
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which I didn’t necessarily
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agree with.
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I just, but it was what it
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was, but we had a rallying
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cry around there.
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We were deemed to be an
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essential business because
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again, we build hospitals,
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we built schools, we built
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food production, power
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generation, so many things
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that if that doesn’t happen,
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the society, the community has
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issues.
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So again, for our sixth
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generation, for our team
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members, that rallying cry of
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we’re doing really cool,
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important stuff.
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That to me keeps that mission
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above anything than family
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dynamics and makes you can
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continue to understand that
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business is bigger than you.
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Jeannie, I think I missed.
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No, I think, I think you
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nailed it.
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We’re just incredibly fortunate
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and blessed to be doing this
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and every day is while
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there’s some challenging
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00:19:34.980 –> 00:19:36.660
days, every day is so cool.
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The different things we get to
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do and the projects we get
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to do and the impacts we
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get to have.
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So looking forward to
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continuing to do it and
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having a lot of fun through
437
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the process as well.
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I love it.
439
00:19:48.580 –> 00:19:49.480
Well, I can hear from
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00:19:49.480 –> 00:19:50.520
talking to you both that
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00:19:50.520 –> 00:19:51.800
the passion that you have for
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the, for the family business
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00:19:52.840 –> 00:19:54.020
and, and the, and the fun
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that you’re having.
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And, and so I just really
446
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appreciate it.
447
00:19:56.420 –> 00:19:58.240
I love talking to, to
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folks who have been so
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00:19:59.760 –> 00:20:01.300
thoughtful about what it
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00:20:01.300 –> 00:20:02.280
means to be part of a
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family business.
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00:20:02.960 –> 00:20:03.840
I, it must be something
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00:20:03.840 –> 00:20:04.800
about those Wisconsin
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based family businesses.
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00:20:06.320 –> 00:20:07.980
You guys have, you guys
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00:20:07.980 –> 00:20:08.860
really haven’t figured it
457
00:20:08.860 –> 00:20:10.100
out, but I, I love it.
458
00:20:10.160 –> 00:20:11.320
I appreciate you taking the
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00:20:11.320 –> 00:20:13.380
time to chat and to
460
00:20:13.380 –> 00:20:14.220
share your insights.
461
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And I hope we get to
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00:20:15.360 –> 00:20:16.200
chat again soon.
463
00:20:16.460 –> 00:20:17.140
Thanks, Jack.
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Thank you for shining a
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spotlight on family
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businesses.
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They’re so important and
468
00:20:21.220 –> 00:20:22.740
appreciate you, you doing
469
00:20:22.740 –> 00:20:23.020
so.
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Absolutely.
471
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Thank you.
472
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In this segment, I sit
473
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down with Port Blakely’s
474
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chairman and now former
475
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CEO, Renee Ancenes and
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his cousin, newly
477
00:20:36.400 –> 00:20:37.840
installed CEO, Mike
478
00:20:37.840 –> 00:20:38.320
Worjon.
479
00:20:38.880 –> 00:20:39.940
In this interview, which
480
00:20:39.940 –> 00:20:41.140
was recorded before the
481
00:20:41.140 –> 00:20:42.240
leadership transition became
482
00:20:42.240 –> 00:20:43.340
official on December
483
00:20:43.340 –> 00:20:46.000
31st, 2025, Ancenes and
484
00:20:46.000 –> 00:20:47.160
Worjon explained how
485
00:20:47.160 –> 00:20:48.160
strong family governance
486
00:20:48.160 –> 00:20:49.360
and a majority independent
487
00:20:49.360 –> 00:20:50.580
board helped ensure
488
00:20:50.580 –> 00:20:52.220
continuity, trust, and
489
00:20:52.220 –> 00:20:53.340
long-term alignment as
490
00:20:53.340 –> 00:20:54.400
the company prepared for
491
00:20:54.400 –> 00:20:55.320
its next chapter.
492
00:20:57.520 –> 00:20:57.900
Hi, Mike.
493
00:20:57.920 –> 00:20:58.380
Hi, Renee.
494
00:20:58.500 –> 00:20:59.240
Thanks so much for
495
00:20:59.240 –> 00:20:59.800
joining me today.
496
00:20:59.880 –> 00:21:00.480
Great to be here.
497
00:21:00.580 –> 00:21:01.360
Good to be here.
498
00:21:01.540 –> 00:21:02.600
So let’s start with the
499
00:21:02.600 –> 00:21:04.100
background of Port
500
00:21:04.100 –> 00:21:05.240
Blakely and how did each
501
00:21:05.240 –> 00:21:06.300
of you first come to
502
00:21:06.300 –> 00:21:06.980
work for the company?
503
00:21:07.220 –> 00:21:08.260
And Renee, I’ll kick
504
00:21:08.260 –> 00:21:09.800
that question to you to
505
00:21:09.800 –> 00:21:10.500
start us off here.
506
00:21:10.680 –> 00:21:11.380
It’s an interesting,
507
00:21:11.840 –> 00:21:12.900
well, we come from
508
00:21:12.900 –> 00:21:13.660
different perspectives,
509
00:21:13.660 –> 00:21:14.480
so that’ll be interesting
510
00:21:14.480 –> 00:21:15.060
even though we’re in
511
00:21:15.060 –> 00:21:15.860
the same generation.
512
00:21:15.940 –> 00:21:17.140
But basically, Port
513
00:21:18.280 –> 00:21:20.480
Blakely was established
514
00:21:20.480 –> 00:21:22.080
in 1864 on
515
00:21:22.080 –> 00:21:23.360
Bainbridge Island in
516
00:21:23.360 –> 00:21:23.700
Seattle.
517
00:21:23.920 –> 00:21:25.360
It was the third
518
00:21:25.360 –> 00:21:27.260
try of the founders
519
00:21:28.040 –> 00:21:29.380
venture into the
520
00:21:29.380 –> 00:21:30.380
timber business back
521
00:21:30.380 –> 00:21:31.140
then in the post
522
00:21:31.140 –> 00:21:31.900
pioneering days.
523
00:21:32.320 –> 00:21:33.320
And then our family,
524
00:21:33.500 –> 00:21:34.360
Mike and I are cousins.
525
00:21:34.840 –> 00:21:35.820
Our family arrived
526
00:21:35.820 –> 00:21:37.000
in Washington in about
527
00:21:37.000 –> 00:21:39.160
1903 and purchased
528
00:21:39.160 –> 00:21:40.660
the assets out of a
529
00:21:40.660 –> 00:21:41.740
basically in a state
530
00:21:42.700 –> 00:21:44.380
with a partnering family.
531
00:21:44.660 –> 00:21:46.700
And then around 1923,
532
00:21:47.300 –> 00:21:48.320
we split off from
533
00:21:48.320 –> 00:21:49.280
that partnering family
534
00:21:49.280 –> 00:21:50.340
and we went on our own.
535
00:21:50.740 –> 00:21:51.720
But our family has been
536
00:21:51.720 –> 00:21:52.660
in the timber business
537
00:21:52.660 –> 00:21:54.420
basically since about 1830.
538
00:21:54.680 –> 00:21:56.040
Goes back multiple
539
00:21:56.040 –> 00:21:57.620
generations through
540
00:21:58.300 –> 00:21:59.700
the the timber boom in
541
00:21:59.700 –> 00:22:01.220
Maine and then in Michigan
542
00:22:01.220 –> 00:22:03.060
and then in 1903 is
543
00:22:03.060 –> 00:22:04.240
basically when we start
544
00:22:04.240 –> 00:22:05.720
counting it as six
545
00:22:05.720 –> 00:22:07.220
generations since then.
546
00:22:07.700 –> 00:22:09.300
So that’s where we’re
547
00:22:09.300 –> 00:22:10.600
today. We’re in the
548
00:22:10.600 –> 00:22:11.800
forestry business that
549
00:22:11.800 –> 00:22:12.420
some would call the
550
00:22:12.420 –> 00:22:13.020
timber business.
551
00:22:13.340 –> 00:22:14.720
But over that many,
552
00:22:14.780 –> 00:22:15.680
many, many decades,
553
00:22:15.740 –> 00:22:16.560
we’ve been in a number
554
00:22:16.560 –> 00:22:17.580
of different businesses
555
00:22:17.580 –> 00:22:18.540
all around the
556
00:22:18.540 –> 00:22:19.100
forestry and wood
557
00:22:19.100 –> 00:22:20.680
products from shipping
558
00:22:20.680 –> 00:22:21.860
to salt trade, to
559
00:22:21.860 –> 00:22:24.000
real estate, to export
560
00:22:24.000 –> 00:22:25.240
shipping again and
561
00:22:25.240 –> 00:22:26.020
out of shipping.
562
00:22:26.240 –> 00:22:27.020
And then ultimately
563
00:22:27.020 –> 00:22:28.280
we are just a
564
00:22:28.280 –> 00:22:29.280
pure forestry play,
565
00:22:29.420 –> 00:22:29.980
which is kind of
566
00:22:29.980 –> 00:22:31.660
our our heart and soul.
567
00:22:32.280 –> 00:22:32.720
Right.
568
00:22:33.260 –> 00:22:33.940
And so, Renee,
569
00:22:33.980 –> 00:22:34.940
how did you first
570
00:22:34.940 –> 00:22:35.660
get involved
571
00:22:35.660 –> 00:22:36.760
in the family business?
572
00:22:37.860 –> 00:22:38.900
Well, I I got
573
00:22:38.900 –> 00:22:40.340
I first got involved
574
00:22:40.340 –> 00:22:43.280
in around 2000, 1999, 2000.
575
00:22:43.280 –> 00:22:44.760
I was living in the Bay Area.
576
00:22:44.940 –> 00:22:46.140
I had no background
577
00:22:46.140 –> 00:22:47.040
in forestry,
578
00:22:47.060 –> 00:22:48.240
but I’d worked in
579
00:22:48.240 –> 00:22:49.040
a couple of Internet
580
00:22:49.040 –> 00:22:50.320
startups that I was
581
00:22:50.320 –> 00:22:50.820
actually trained
582
00:22:50.820 –> 00:22:51.440
as a musician.
583
00:22:51.520 –> 00:22:52.420
So I was supplementing
584
00:22:52.420 –> 00:22:53.980
my income and I was doing
585
00:22:54.460 –> 00:22:55.380
Internet startups
586
00:22:55.380 –> 00:22:56.720
and basically seeing
587
00:22:56.720 –> 00:22:57.960
how people could be
588
00:22:57.960 –> 00:22:58.640
treated poorly.
589
00:22:59.660 –> 00:23:00.940
And in the periphery,
590
00:23:00.980 –> 00:23:01.460
I’d been coming
591
00:23:01.460 –> 00:23:02.340
to annual meetings
592
00:23:02.340 –> 00:23:03.660
and started to get a sense
593
00:23:03.660 –> 00:23:04.900
that there was this
594
00:23:04.900 –> 00:23:06.240
better way of doing things,
595
00:23:06.680 –> 00:23:07.660
of treating people.
596
00:23:07.740 –> 00:23:09.020
And around 2000,
597
00:23:09.560 –> 00:23:11.040
there was a task force
598
00:23:11.040 –> 00:23:12.460
formed to work on
599
00:23:12.460 –> 00:23:13.720
a family employment policy.
600
00:23:13.800 –> 00:23:14.920
And because I’d had this
601
00:23:14.920 –> 00:23:16.220
kind of bad experience,
602
00:23:16.720 –> 00:23:17.400
I thought, well,
603
00:23:17.400 –> 00:23:18.380
that would be interesting.
604
00:23:18.420 –> 00:23:19.200
And it was a very
605
00:23:19.200 –> 00:23:19.960
interesting person
606
00:23:19.960 –> 00:23:20.520
who had come to
607
00:23:20.520 –> 00:23:21.240
our annual meeting.
608
00:23:21.240 –> 00:23:22.360
And that was John Davis
609
00:23:22.360 –> 00:23:23.680
from at that time.
610
00:23:23.680 –> 00:23:25.240
He was with teaching
611
00:23:25.240 –> 00:23:26.020
a program at Harvard
612
00:23:26.020 –> 00:23:26.880
Business School.
613
00:23:27.660 –> 00:23:28.380
And I just thought
614
00:23:28.380 –> 00:23:29.080
it would be interesting.
615
00:23:29.200 –> 00:23:30.100
So that was kind of my hook
616
00:23:30.100 –> 00:23:30.880
was really more about
617
00:23:30.880 –> 00:23:31.840
how people are treated
618
00:23:31.840 –> 00:23:33.200
and through that angle.
619
00:23:33.440 –> 00:23:34.460
And that led to the forming
620
00:23:34.460 –> 00:23:35.540
of our family council
621
00:23:35.540 –> 00:23:36.600
and our governance structure
622
00:23:36.600 –> 00:23:37.380
and sort of the rest
623
00:23:37.380 –> 00:23:37.780
is history.
624
00:23:37.820 –> 00:23:39.240
So I came in through that door.
625
00:23:40.380 –> 00:23:41.220
Mike has a very different,
626
00:23:41.360 –> 00:23:42.140
I think, very interesting
627
00:23:42.140 –> 00:23:42.860
experience, too.
628
00:23:42.880 –> 00:23:44.680
So I’ll pass it over to Mike
629
00:23:44.680 –> 00:23:46.040
for his perspective.
630
00:23:46.460 –> 00:23:47.400
Yeah, thanks, Renee.
631
00:23:48.440 –> 00:23:49.520
So it’s interesting
632
00:23:49.520 –> 00:23:50.540
because Port Blakely
633
00:23:50.540 –> 00:23:52.840
is a company that
634
00:23:52.840 –> 00:23:55.000
there’s very few family members
635
00:23:55.000 –> 00:23:56.080
that work for the company.
636
00:23:56.140 –> 00:23:57.080
It’s a big family.
637
00:23:58.460 –> 00:24:00.120
But and just coincidentally
638
00:24:00.120 –> 00:24:01.780
and luckily, I happen
639
00:24:01.780 –> 00:24:03.260
my father was one of
640
00:24:03.260 –> 00:24:04.180
the family members
641
00:24:04.180 –> 00:24:05.460
that was involved directly
642
00:24:05.460 –> 00:24:06.360
with the business
643
00:24:06.360 –> 00:24:07.860
for his entire career.
644
00:24:09.340 –> 00:24:10.340
And there’s only been
645
00:24:10.340 –> 00:24:11.880
a half a dozen actual
646
00:24:11.880 –> 00:24:13.780
family members that have worked
647
00:24:13.780 –> 00:24:15.480
here over the last century.
648
00:24:17.220 –> 00:24:18.580
But, you know, so
649
00:24:18.580 –> 00:24:20.020
my father was a forester.
650
00:24:20.340 –> 00:24:21.480
He he worked in the woods
651
00:24:21.480 –> 00:24:22.260
his whole career
652
00:24:22.260 –> 00:24:24.120
and as a, you know, as a child,
653
00:24:24.140 –> 00:24:25.160
I would follow him around.
654
00:24:25.640 –> 00:24:26.600
And I think long before
655
00:24:26.600 –> 00:24:27.860
I even really understood
656
00:24:27.860 –> 00:24:30.120
my my family relationship
657
00:24:30.120 –> 00:24:31.000
with the ownership,
658
00:24:31.920 –> 00:24:33.220
I wanted to be a forester
659
00:24:33.220 –> 00:24:33.780
like my dad.
660
00:24:34.980 –> 00:24:36.580
So I grew up in that world.
661
00:24:36.840 –> 00:24:37.840
I went off to college
662
00:24:37.840 –> 00:24:39.040
to get a degree in economics
663
00:24:39.040 –> 00:24:40.380
and, you know, toyed
664
00:24:40.380 –> 00:24:41.120
with the idea of being
665
00:24:41.120 –> 00:24:42.500
a stock trader for a while.
666
00:24:44.020 –> 00:24:45.820
But the force called me back
667
00:24:45.820 –> 00:24:48.460
and, you know, thus begin
668
00:24:48.460 –> 00:24:50.820
a 28 year journey now
669
00:24:51.340 –> 00:24:53.280
as an employee at Port Blakely
670
00:24:53.280 –> 00:24:54.180
and soon to take over
671
00:24:54.180 –> 00:24:55.100
the helm of CEO.
672
00:24:55.740 –> 00:24:58.140
So it’s been it’s been my life
673
00:24:58.140 –> 00:24:59.180
from the beginning.
674
00:24:59.900 –> 00:25:01.140
I love that.
675
00:25:01.840 –> 00:25:02.480
And so, yeah, Mike,
676
00:25:02.480 –> 00:25:03.300
you mentioned that
677
00:25:03.300 –> 00:25:05.740
the reason why we’re chatting today,
678
00:25:05.960 –> 00:25:06.440
other than the fact
679
00:25:06.440 –> 00:25:07.180
that it’s just a really
680
00:25:07.180 –> 00:25:07.820
interesting family
681
00:25:07.820 –> 00:25:08.900
and an interesting story
682
00:25:08.900 –> 00:25:10.540
is that you are about
683
00:25:10.540 –> 00:25:12.080
to take over from Renee
684
00:25:12.080 –> 00:25:15.060
as CEO December 31st, correct?
685
00:25:16.400 –> 00:25:18.180
And Renee, you are the
686
00:25:18.180 –> 00:25:19.120
the chair of the board
687
00:25:19.120 –> 00:25:20.360
of directors and CEO.
688
00:25:20.360 –> 00:25:21.200
So you’re going to continue
689
00:25:21.200 –> 00:25:22.120
as chair and Mike’s
690
00:25:22.120 –> 00:25:23.260
going to take over as CEO.
691
00:25:23.420 –> 00:25:24.600
So I want to talk a little bit
692
00:25:24.600 –> 00:25:25.440
about the succession
693
00:25:25.440 –> 00:25:26.700
planning and leadership
694
00:25:26.700 –> 00:25:27.740
transition process.
695
00:25:28.140 –> 00:25:29.640
Mike, what has that been like
696
00:25:29.640 –> 00:25:31.000
from your perspective
697
00:25:31.940 –> 00:25:33.580
to to get prepared
698
00:25:33.580 –> 00:25:35.440
to take this CEO role on?
699
00:25:37.060 –> 00:25:37.880
Yeah, great question.
700
00:25:38.280 –> 00:25:41.220
So I’ll go back a little bit
701
00:25:41.220 –> 00:25:42.240
and say that, you know,
702
00:25:42.240 –> 00:25:43.240
I was working here
703
00:25:43.240 –> 00:25:44.420
when they made the announcement
704
00:25:44.420 –> 00:25:45.460
that Renee was going to be
705
00:25:45.460 –> 00:25:47.820
our next CEO 16 years ago
706
00:25:47.820 –> 00:25:48.480
or whatever it was.
707
00:25:48.480 –> 00:25:49.260
It’s been a while.
708
00:25:50.900 –> 00:25:53.000
And he was taking over
709
00:25:53.000 –> 00:25:54.000
Jim Warjohn, who was
710
00:25:54.000 –> 00:25:55.900
at the time a family CEO.
711
00:25:56.380 –> 00:25:57.760
And I can remember
712
00:25:57.760 –> 00:25:59.140
being in that room
713
00:25:59.140 –> 00:26:00.540
and looking around the room.
714
00:26:00.960 –> 00:26:01.780
And there was
715
00:26:01.780 –> 00:26:02.820
there was an audible
716
00:26:02.820 –> 00:26:05.160
sigh of relief, in my opinion,
717
00:26:05.440 –> 00:26:07.240
that from the employees,
718
00:26:08.100 –> 00:26:09.640
that that another family member
719
00:26:09.640 –> 00:26:10.700
would be taking over.
720
00:26:10.740 –> 00:26:12.200
And I think that
721
00:26:12.200 –> 00:26:13.740
that it’s really important
722
00:26:13.740 –> 00:26:14.820
to the employees that work here,
723
00:26:14.860 –> 00:26:15.300
a lot of them
724
00:26:15.300 –> 00:26:16.560
that I’ve talked to about it,
725
00:26:16.960 –> 00:26:18.020
that it’s that the company
726
00:26:18.020 –> 00:26:19.200
is owned and managed
727
00:26:19.200 –> 00:26:20.160
by a family member.
728
00:26:20.620 –> 00:26:21.220
And that, you know,
729
00:26:21.340 –> 00:26:22.740
that sort of that generational
730
00:26:22.740 –> 00:26:23.800
approach to investment
731
00:26:23.800 –> 00:26:25.480
that we we pride ourselves,
732
00:26:25.480 –> 00:26:27.240
you know, in that philosophy
733
00:26:28.420 –> 00:26:29.900
is largely enabled
734
00:26:29.900 –> 00:26:31.140
and underwritten by the fact
735
00:26:31.140 –> 00:26:32.100
that you’ve got a family
736
00:26:32.100 –> 00:26:32.860
member at the top.
737
00:26:33.440 –> 00:26:35.480
And so they they work here.
738
00:26:35.700 –> 00:26:36.740
You know, the
739
00:26:36.740 –> 00:26:37.860
the owners of the company
740
00:26:37.860 –> 00:26:39.340
care very much about the employees.
741
00:26:39.680 –> 00:26:41.600
And so as you know,
742
00:26:41.600 –> 00:26:43.080
at that time, I remember
743
00:26:43.080 –> 00:26:44.360
observing that.
744
00:26:44.740 –> 00:26:45.580
And I’m not going to say
745
00:26:45.580 –> 00:26:46.140
I was surprised,
746
00:26:46.180 –> 00:26:47.620
but I was surprised at how
747
00:26:48.220 –> 00:26:50.560
open people were about that feeling.
748
00:26:52.420 –> 00:26:54.480
And so, you know, as time goes on
749
00:26:54.480 –> 00:26:56.680
and Renee’s winding towards retirement,
750
00:26:58.360 –> 00:26:59.600
I started thinking about
751
00:26:59.600 –> 00:27:00.540
this next step,
752
00:27:01.220 –> 00:27:02.100
you know, to directly
753
00:27:02.100 –> 00:27:02.820
answer your question.
754
00:27:02.820 –> 00:27:04.020
And I started asking,
755
00:27:04.280 –> 00:27:05.320
sort of having.
756
00:27:05.820 –> 00:27:06.940
Subtle, but sort of
757
00:27:06.940 –> 00:27:07.980
step level conversations
758
00:27:07.980 –> 00:27:08.760
with people about
759
00:27:08.760 –> 00:27:09.660
what’s their vision
760
00:27:09.660 –> 00:27:11.420
for the future of the business.
761
00:27:11.540 –> 00:27:12.460
These are employees,
762
00:27:12.620 –> 00:27:13.800
you know, managers and directors
763
00:27:13.800 –> 00:27:15.180
and what what, you know,
764
00:27:15.240 –> 00:27:16.420
what excites you about working here?
765
00:27:16.420 –> 00:27:17.940
What do you really think
766
00:27:17.940 –> 00:27:20.140
we can do in the next generation?
767
00:27:20.760 –> 00:27:22.240
Because I wanted to kind of inform
768
00:27:22.240 –> 00:27:24.600
my world view on what leadership
769
00:27:24.600 –> 00:27:25.360
would look like,
770
00:27:25.360 –> 00:27:26.660
you know, going forward.
771
00:27:27.600 –> 00:27:29.060
And and all of that
772
00:27:29.060 –> 00:27:30.500
is built around this idea
773
00:27:30.500 –> 00:27:31.960
of just maintaining trust
774
00:27:31.960 –> 00:27:33.760
and building trust with the employees
775
00:27:33.760 –> 00:27:35.400
and knowing,
776
00:27:35.660 –> 00:27:37.740
you know, they need to know
777
00:27:37.740 –> 00:27:39.300
that we really care
778
00:27:39.300 –> 00:27:40.780
and I care about,
779
00:27:40.780 –> 00:27:42.800
you know, the success of the company
780
00:27:42.800 –> 00:27:44.140
for their benefit, you know.
781
00:27:44.480 –> 00:27:45.000
Right.
782
00:27:45.000 –> 00:27:47.440
So so leading up to the succession
783
00:27:47.440 –> 00:27:48.640
sort of announcement
784
00:27:48.640 –> 00:27:50.220
was a lot of me in the background,
785
00:27:50.220 –> 00:27:51.860
just kind of trying to feel out
786
00:27:51.860 –> 00:27:53.400
where where people think
787
00:27:53.400 –> 00:27:54.260
we need to be going.
788
00:27:54.700 –> 00:27:56.380
And that that really helped me
789
00:27:56.380 –> 00:27:57.300
have a clear point of view
790
00:27:57.300 –> 00:27:58.440
when I stood up in front of the board
791
00:27:58.440 –> 00:27:59.740
and said, yeah, I want this job
792
00:28:00.560 –> 00:28:02.240
and here’s what I kind of
793
00:28:02.240 –> 00:28:03.180
think we need to do.
794
00:28:04.240 –> 00:28:06.000
Yeah, I think that was helpful.
795
00:28:06.880 –> 00:28:07.680
Yeah, it’s excellent.
796
00:28:07.720 –> 00:28:08.580
And it’s really interesting
797
00:28:08.580 –> 00:28:10.600
because we have seen a trend
798
00:28:10.600 –> 00:28:11.760
more recently where family
799
00:28:11.760 –> 00:28:13.300
businesses are looking at the idea
800
00:28:13.300 –> 00:28:14.420
of bringing a non-family
801
00:28:14.420 –> 00:28:17.000
CEO or some kind of non-family leaders.
802
00:28:17.020 –> 00:28:17.720
And that’s not to say
803
00:28:17.720 –> 00:28:18.480
that there’s anything
804
00:28:18.480 –> 00:28:19.860
wrong with either approach,
805
00:28:19.860 –> 00:28:21.020
but it’s interesting to hear
806
00:28:21.020 –> 00:28:22.320
that that for you all,
807
00:28:22.320 –> 00:28:23.400
it’s important to have
808
00:28:23.400 –> 00:28:24.740
a family member at the helm.
809
00:28:24.760 –> 00:28:26.040
But if you’re going to do that,
810
00:28:26.040 –> 00:28:26.820
you also have to make sure
811
00:28:26.820 –> 00:28:28.680
that somebody who’s qualified
812
00:28:28.680 –> 00:28:30.580
and prepared to take over that role.
813
00:28:30.860 –> 00:28:32.080
Right. And so, Mike,
814
00:28:32.100 –> 00:28:33.000
it sounds like that was
815
00:28:33.000 –> 00:28:34.280
obviously very important
816
00:28:35.000 –> 00:28:37.100
part of this process for you.
817
00:28:37.380 –> 00:28:38.440
Renee, what was this process
818
00:28:38.440 –> 00:28:40.020
like from from your perspective
819
00:28:40.020 –> 00:28:43.080
to to kind of wind down as CEO
820
00:28:43.080 –> 00:28:45.500
and get Mike ready for ready for action?
821
00:28:46.700 –> 00:28:48.840
Well, it’s a super interesting process
822
00:28:48.840 –> 00:28:50.240
because, as I mentioned earlier,
823
00:28:50.380 –> 00:28:52.240
one of the kind of the hook
824
00:28:52.240 –> 00:28:53.860
for me was employment policy.
825
00:28:54.420 –> 00:28:55.840
Back in two ninety nine,
826
00:28:55.900 –> 00:28:56.860
two thousand for a whole
827
00:28:56.860 –> 00:28:58.260
different bunch of reasons.
828
00:28:58.320 –> 00:28:59.360
But one of the early things
829
00:28:59.360 –> 00:29:01.340
I learned about good family governance
830
00:29:01.340 –> 00:29:04.300
is that you have to have these clear,
831
00:29:05.200 –> 00:29:07.460
you know, kind of standards
832
00:29:07.460 –> 00:29:08.860
of of connection,
833
00:29:09.120 –> 00:29:10.300
the roles and responsibilities
834
00:29:10.300 –> 00:29:12.120
of the corporate board from the family,
835
00:29:12.120 –> 00:29:13.180
from the owners.
836
00:29:13.820 –> 00:29:15.020
The three circle model
837
00:29:15.020 –> 00:29:16.200
was really helpful to me
838
00:29:16.200 –> 00:29:17.060
and a lot of the family
839
00:29:17.060 –> 00:29:18.500
to make sure that you
840
00:29:18.500 –> 00:29:20.300
you really focus on the areas
841
00:29:20.300 –> 00:29:21.620
that the corporate governance
842
00:29:21.620 –> 00:29:22.740
focuses on the areas
843
00:29:22.740 –> 00:29:23.800
that’s what’s best
844
00:29:23.800 –> 00:29:25.280
for the company and the business.
845
00:29:25.320 –> 00:29:26.840
And the family has to talk about
846
00:29:26.840 –> 00:29:28.300
what’s best for the family.
847
00:29:28.520 –> 00:29:29.920
And there’s this overlink.
848
00:29:30.040 –> 00:29:32.060
So I say that because I think
849
00:29:32.060 –> 00:29:33.440
what the process has been for me
850
00:29:33.440 –> 00:29:34.660
is a little bit of bookends.
851
00:29:34.800 –> 00:29:35.760
I was brought in.
852
00:29:35.960 –> 00:29:37.240
And when I was
853
00:29:37.240 –> 00:29:39.100
basically recruited to come in
854
00:29:39.100 –> 00:29:40.540
from the outside of the company,
855
00:29:40.600 –> 00:29:41.820
my first question is,
856
00:29:41.820 –> 00:29:42.840
sort of, why me?
857
00:29:43.320 –> 00:29:44.260
And at the time,
858
00:29:44.300 –> 00:29:45.760
what the company really needed is
859
00:29:45.760 –> 00:29:47.180
and what the board felt
860
00:29:47.180 –> 00:29:48.360
and what my predecessor,
861
00:29:48.500 –> 00:29:49.760
Jim Worjon, was really clear
862
00:29:49.760 –> 00:29:50.920
about explaining is they need
863
00:29:50.920 –> 00:29:51.760
somebody who can bring
864
00:29:51.760 –> 00:29:52.760
the family together
865
00:29:52.760 –> 00:29:54.180
to build the trust and pride
866
00:29:54.180 –> 00:29:55.540
in the company, as we say.
867
00:29:56.560 –> 00:29:57.780
Make sure that we’re building
868
00:29:57.780 –> 00:29:59.240
on this momentum of cohesion
869
00:29:59.240 –> 00:30:00.820
so that we stay family owned
870
00:30:00.820 –> 00:30:01.820
and that the family
871
00:30:01.820 –> 00:30:03.500
really understands the business.
872
00:30:03.900 –> 00:30:04.940
So I came in more
873
00:30:04.940 –> 00:30:06.300
from from that perspective.
874
00:30:06.740 –> 00:30:07.900
And similarly, you know,
875
00:30:07.980 –> 00:30:08.880
all these years later
876
00:30:08.880 –> 00:30:10.820
and technically it’s 20 years later,
877
00:30:10.820 –> 00:30:13.100
but 15 in the CEO role.
878
00:30:14.200 –> 00:30:15.060
It’s interesting because
879
00:30:15.060 –> 00:30:16.340
I had a very similar experience
880
00:30:16.340 –> 00:30:18.060
that Mike described on my first day,
881
00:30:18.100 –> 00:30:19.200
which I vividly remember
882
00:30:19.200 –> 00:30:20.940
going down to our forestry operation.
883
00:30:21.100 –> 00:30:22.440
And how many people came up to me
884
00:30:22.440 –> 00:30:23.980
and thanked me and said,
885
00:30:24.020 –> 00:30:25.000
we’re so glad to have
886
00:30:25.000 –> 00:30:26.060
a family member here.
887
00:30:27.300 –> 00:30:27.660
So, you know,
888
00:30:27.660 –> 00:30:28.680
there’s a couple of things
889
00:30:28.680 –> 00:30:30.240
that tie that back
890
00:30:30.240 –> 00:30:31.280
to the corporate governance.
891
00:30:31.460 –> 00:30:32.280
The corporate governance,
892
00:30:32.300 –> 00:30:34.140
you know, the board looks at this
893
00:30:34.140 –> 00:30:34.620
and says, well,
894
00:30:34.640 –> 00:30:36.000
what does the company need now?
895
00:30:36.080 –> 00:30:37.280
Well, we’re very different company.
896
00:30:37.460 –> 00:30:38.960
We’re not a, you know,
897
00:30:39.040 –> 00:30:40.200
sort of a family enterprise
898
00:30:40.200 –> 00:30:41.480
with four or five businesses.
899
00:30:41.660 –> 00:30:43.220
We’re really a pure forestry play.
900
00:30:43.720 –> 00:30:44.720
We’ve built the cohesion
901
00:30:44.720 –> 00:30:46.060
and the trust of the family.
902
00:30:46.260 –> 00:30:47.600
And now it’s really about
903
00:30:47.600 –> 00:30:49.820
what can we do in our core business?
904
00:30:49.960 –> 00:30:51.680
So looking at the skills
905
00:30:52.480 –> 00:30:53.440
and competencies,
906
00:30:53.540 –> 00:30:55.060
both internally and externally,
907
00:30:55.160 –> 00:30:56.960
the board began to think about
908
00:30:56.960 –> 00:30:58.320
is it the right time
909
00:30:58.320 –> 00:30:59.980
to go outside and have a nonfamily?
910
00:31:00.060 –> 00:31:02.560
Do we have any talent inside?
911
00:31:03.040 –> 00:31:04.920
We wanted to make sure as a board
912
00:31:04.920 –> 00:31:07.700
that we were thinking about
913
00:31:07.700 –> 00:31:09.160
the next 10 to 20 years
914
00:31:09.160 –> 00:31:10.360
of the company’s trajectory.
915
00:31:10.600 –> 00:31:11.460
And we were fortunate
916
00:31:11.460 –> 00:31:13.020
that when we came full circle,
917
00:31:13.200 –> 00:31:14.640
we found, and, you know,
918
00:31:14.640 –> 00:31:15.480
in talking to Mike,
919
00:31:15.480 –> 00:31:16.780
he had all those qualities.
920
00:31:17.160 –> 00:31:18.260
But the board at the same time
921
00:31:18.260 –> 00:31:19.220
did have to consider
922
00:31:19.220 –> 00:31:20.980
what would it take to go outside?
923
00:31:21.360 –> 00:31:22.460
We can talk about,
924
00:31:22.500 –> 00:31:23.840
if you’re interested,
925
00:31:24.060 –> 00:31:25.680
some of the things we learned about that.
926
00:31:25.980 –> 00:31:27.680
But the full circle was that
927
00:31:28.660 –> 00:31:31.260
it’s been a really interesting journey for me
928
00:31:31.260 –> 00:31:34.260
to see how the company over a long term
929
00:31:34.260 –> 00:31:35.820
pivots a little bit around
930
00:31:35.820 –> 00:31:37.020
what’s best for the company
931
00:31:37.020 –> 00:31:38.300
and how that’s impacted
932
00:31:38.300 –> 00:31:40.620
our succession planning over the years.
933
00:31:42.080 –> 00:31:42.520
Absolutely.
934
00:31:42.620 –> 00:31:44.240
And I would love to talk a little bit more.
935
00:31:44.240 –> 00:31:45.860
Why don’t we go right to that now?
936
00:31:45.980 –> 00:31:46.700
Let me talk a little bit more
937
00:31:46.700 –> 00:31:47.500
about what you learned
938
00:31:47.500 –> 00:31:49.440
from that process of thinking about,
939
00:31:49.440 –> 00:31:50.300
you know, going outside.
940
00:31:50.580 –> 00:31:52.320
Well, yeah, I think the exercise
941
00:31:52.320 –> 00:31:53.440
that the board went through,
942
00:31:53.500 –> 00:31:54.520
and just to provide
943
00:31:54.520 –> 00:31:55.500
a little bit of background,
944
00:31:55.560 –> 00:31:57.960
because I know people in family business
945
00:31:57.960 –> 00:31:59.200
will be curious about this.
946
00:31:59.380 –> 00:32:00.560
Before I ever arrived,
947
00:32:00.960 –> 00:32:02.580
my predecessor put in place
948
00:32:02.580 –> 00:32:03.800
a board structure
949
00:32:03.800 –> 00:32:05.380
where we had a majority independent
950
00:32:05.380 –> 00:32:06.600
professional board members
951
00:32:06.600 –> 00:32:10.080
and then we had family members on the board.
952
00:32:11.080 –> 00:32:13.280
So we are currently 11 board members,
953
00:32:13.360 –> 00:32:14.880
six independent, five family,
954
00:32:15.160 –> 00:32:17.500
and myself included on the family side as chair.
955
00:32:18.040 –> 00:32:19.440
That was a good call
956
00:32:19.440 –> 00:32:21.420
because it really started this process
957
00:32:21.420 –> 00:32:23.740
of making sure we were applying best practices
958
00:32:23.740 –> 00:32:25.300
and independent company boards
959
00:32:25.300 –> 00:32:27.540
and bringing in that expertise
960
00:32:28.240 –> 00:32:29.800
from outside board experience.
961
00:32:29.860 –> 00:32:32.260
And the way that kind of played itself out
962
00:32:32.260 –> 00:32:34.700
in this scenario was,
963
00:32:35.260 –> 00:32:36.720
again, really wanting to make sure
964
00:32:36.720 –> 00:32:39.240
that we had what was right for the company.
965
00:32:39.460 –> 00:32:40.880
And when they went through that
966
00:32:40.880 –> 00:32:42.760
very diligent process
967
00:32:42.760 –> 00:32:44.520
and saying, well, you know,
968
00:32:45.040 –> 00:32:47.020
what are the pros and cons of a non-family?
969
00:32:48.120 –> 00:32:49.300
Making sure we brought in
970
00:32:49.300 –> 00:32:50.920
some outside current thinking
971
00:32:50.920 –> 00:32:52.840
and could we attract somebody,
972
00:32:52.860 –> 00:32:54.280
which we felt like we could.
973
00:32:54.700 –> 00:32:57.080
But there are also risks of the, you know,
974
00:32:57.300 –> 00:32:59.020
system rejection of a non-family member.
975
00:32:59.060 –> 00:33:01.120
And also what you heard Mike say,
976
00:33:01.200 –> 00:33:03.600
we have a culture that really values
977
00:33:03.600 –> 00:33:06.460
and really tightly aligns with family management.
978
00:33:06.740 –> 00:33:08.400
And so, but in that process,
979
00:33:08.400 –> 00:33:10.000
I think one of the things that board realizes
980
00:33:10.000 –> 00:33:11.800
is that our family governance structure,
981
00:33:11.840 –> 00:33:15.080
which we put in place, say in around 2000 to 2004,
982
00:33:15.780 –> 00:33:16.960
really needed some upgrading.
983
00:33:17.300 –> 00:33:20.280
Our family council has been very productive
984
00:33:20.280 –> 00:33:21.800
and has been very impactful,
985
00:33:21.800 –> 00:33:25.860
but it really kind of raised the awareness
986
00:33:25.860 –> 00:33:27.920
that at least in our structure,
987
00:33:27.960 –> 00:33:29.220
there’s a real need to make sure
988
00:33:29.220 –> 00:33:30.480
the owner’s voice is heard,
989
00:33:30.480 –> 00:33:33.680
that the family council is more sustainable on its own.
990
00:33:33.680 –> 00:33:35.340
And we’ve talked to other family companies
991
00:33:35.340 –> 00:33:37.020
that run into this after they’ve, you know,
992
00:33:37.020 –> 00:33:39.880
built their council and their constitution over 20, 30 years.
993
00:33:39.920 –> 00:33:42.060
There’s sort of a next level you need to go to.
994
00:33:42.420 –> 00:33:45.320
And so that has pushed us towards
995
00:33:45.900 –> 00:33:47.820
an evolution of our family governance
996
00:33:47.820 –> 00:33:50.340
where we’re now talking about the family president role
997
00:33:50.340 –> 00:33:53.020
taking on more, sorry,
998
00:33:53.100 –> 00:33:55.280
the family council president role taking on more scope,
999
00:33:55.680 –> 00:33:56.660
more responsibility,
1000
00:33:56.660 –> 00:33:58.520
and making sure that the family council
1001
00:33:58.520 –> 00:34:00.640
representing the family and the owners
1002
00:34:01.160 –> 00:34:04.800
has more, I would say more accountability
1003
00:34:04.800 –> 00:34:08.420
and higher expectations, but also continuing support.
1004
00:34:08.460 –> 00:34:10.820
So we’re evolving that role to a president
1005
00:34:10.820 –> 00:34:13.120
that will report to the CEO
1006
00:34:13.120 –> 00:34:16.600
and will be at least initially a contract employee
1007
00:34:16.600 –> 00:34:18.080
and how we do that.
1008
00:34:18.440 –> 00:34:21.139
That came about as part of this succession process,
1009
00:34:21.340 –> 00:34:22.380
kind of long story short,
1010
00:34:22.460 –> 00:34:23.860
is realizing we needed to shore up
1011
00:34:23.860 –> 00:34:25.400
our family business governance
1012
00:34:25.940 –> 00:34:27.400
for long-term sustainability.
1013
00:34:27.400 –> 00:34:29.080
So what we’re creating now
1014
00:34:29.080 –> 00:34:31.940
is kind of a next gen partnership.
1015
00:34:32.600 –> 00:34:34.600
So CEO, chair, family president,
1016
00:34:34.600 –> 00:34:37.000
and of course the board and the CFO
1017
00:34:37.000 –> 00:34:39.719
all play a big role in family connection
1018
00:34:39.719 –> 00:34:41.020
and ownership representation.
1019
00:34:41.739 –> 00:34:43.560
I think it’s also, you know,
1020
00:34:43.560 –> 00:34:47.420
when you consider Renee’s career
1021
00:34:47.420 –> 00:34:49.159
began on the family governance side
1022
00:34:49.159 –> 00:34:51.260
and the creation of the original provisional family
1023
00:34:51.260 –> 00:34:52.659
council and all of that business,
1024
00:34:53.239 –> 00:34:55.480
there’s a little bit of a, you know,
1025
00:34:55.480 –> 00:34:57.820
I would use an analogy of, you know,
1026
00:34:58.480 –> 00:35:00.340
a child that’s learning to ride a bike, you know,
1027
00:35:00.380 –> 00:35:03.440
for the first time and the parent is running along
1028
00:35:03.440 –> 00:35:04.820
behind them, holding onto the seat.
1029
00:35:05.600 –> 00:35:08.400
And at some point you let go and they don’t know it.
1030
00:35:08.560 –> 00:35:12.100
And my sense is that the family governance system
1031
00:35:12.100 –> 00:35:15.380
is working well and this family president thing
1032
00:35:15.380 –> 00:35:18.680
is gonna sort of codify that they are on their own,
1033
00:35:18.680 –> 00:35:21.860
you know, as far as they don’t have Renee there,
1034
00:35:22.380 –> 00:35:25.040
you know, as the guy that it’s been there the whole time
1035
00:35:25.040 –> 00:35:27.080
when he’s no longer in that room,
1036
00:35:27.800 –> 00:35:30.020
that they’re gonna have the ability to ride the bike
1037
00:35:30.020 –> 00:35:32.580
on their own and I think it’s gonna really help.
1038
00:35:33.820 –> 00:35:35.360
Yeah, we’re just buying helmets for everybody.
1039
00:35:38.420 –> 00:35:39.540
No, I love that.
1040
00:35:39.600 –> 00:35:41.220
And I love that you’re being so thoughtful
1041
00:35:41.220 –> 00:35:43.280
about shoring it up for the future.
1042
00:35:43.880 –> 00:35:46.260
And we were just in San Diego last week
1043
00:35:46.260 –> 00:35:49.220
as we’re recording this for our transitions fall event
1044
00:35:49.220 –> 00:35:51.100
and shout out to Amanda Starr,
1045
00:35:51.200 –> 00:35:53.700
who’s the family council head for Port Blakely
1046
00:35:53.700 –> 00:35:55.580
and Liz Marsoloff who’s the chief people officer.
1047
00:35:55.640 –> 00:35:57.700
They gave a really great presentation
1048
00:35:58.560 –> 00:36:00.440
on exactly what you were just talking about
1049
00:36:00.440 –> 00:36:01.760
and why it’s so important.
1050
00:36:02.040 –> 00:36:04.500
Even if you have strong family governance already
1051
00:36:04.500 –> 00:36:06.600
in place, making sure that it’s sustainable
1052
00:36:06.600 –> 00:36:07.560
for the future.
1053
00:36:09.180 –> 00:36:10.460
And Renee, you touched on this a little bit,
1054
00:36:10.480 –> 00:36:12.820
but Mike, I wanted to kind of get your thoughts too.
1055
00:36:14.560 –> 00:36:17.940
How important was this strong family governance model
1056
00:36:17.940 –> 00:36:22.380
to your transition into the CEO role?
1057
00:36:22.560 –> 00:36:23.240
Like, how did that play?
1058
00:36:23.240 –> 00:36:25.000
What factor did that play?
1059
00:36:26.660 –> 00:36:32.500
Well, I mean, for me it’s like all family business.
1060
00:36:33.300 –> 00:36:35.640
There’s over a hundred of us that are related
1061
00:36:35.640 –> 00:36:39.420
that own this company and managing a company
1062
00:36:39.420 –> 00:36:42.020
for over a hundred of your cousins can be daunting.
1063
00:36:42.620 –> 00:36:45.660
And the fact that we have such a robust
1064
00:36:45.660 –> 00:36:50.200
and mature family governance system in place
1065
00:36:50.200 –> 00:36:53.100
gives me comfort that I’ll be able to do
1066
00:36:53.100 –> 00:36:54.480
the job of managing the business
1067
00:36:54.480 –> 00:36:58.020
and not also have to be always dealing with
1068
00:36:58.020 –> 00:37:01.120
whatever family issue might come up.
1069
00:37:01.740 –> 00:37:02.920
There’ll be some of that, I know,
1070
00:37:02.960 –> 00:37:04.280
and Renee’s gonna sort of smile
1071
00:37:04.280 –> 00:37:06.800
because the CEO is always involved
1072
00:37:06.800 –> 00:37:07.640
in a few of those things.
1073
00:37:08.200 –> 00:37:10.820
But the fact that this system is in place
1074
00:37:10.820 –> 00:37:14.360
is one of the things that makes me really comfortable
1075
00:37:14.360 –> 00:37:16.640
in the decision to move ahead with this role.
1076
00:37:23.120 –> 00:37:26.320
You’re not just a CEO, you’re a family business CEO.
1077
00:37:26.680 –> 00:37:28.080
You don’t just serve on a board,
1078
00:37:28.080 –> 00:37:30.080
you’re a board member of a family business.
1079
00:37:30.760 –> 00:37:33.620
You don’t just lead a group, you lead a family council.
1080
00:37:34.180 –> 00:37:36.080
That’s why Family Business Compass exists,
1081
00:37:36.480 –> 00:37:39.200
a national membership community designed exclusively
1082
00:37:39.200 –> 00:37:40.660
for family business leaders
1083
00:37:40.660 –> 00:37:43.320
from the team behind Family Business Magazine.
1084
00:37:44.380 –> 00:37:46.720
Built on 35 plus years of experience,
1085
00:37:47.320 –> 00:37:49.180
Family Business Compass offers peer groups,
1086
00:37:49.520 –> 00:37:51.380
tools and templates, online education,
1087
00:37:51.840 –> 00:37:53.360
research, events, and more.
1088
00:37:54.180 –> 00:37:55.780
We are launching more peer groups now
1089
00:37:55.780 –> 00:37:58.080
with limited spots to ensure valuable interaction
1090
00:37:58.080 –> 00:38:00.740
and demand has exceeded expectations.
1091
00:38:01.880 –> 00:38:04.520
Apply now at familybusinessmagazine.com
1092
00:38:04.520 –> 00:38:07.160
slash family-business-compass
1093
00:38:07.800 –> 00:38:10.660
to strengthen your governance, leadership, and legacy.
1094
00:38:14.690 –> 00:38:15.790
That’s it for this episode
1095
00:38:15.790 –> 00:38:17.910
of the Family Business Business Family podcast.
1096
00:38:18.930 –> 00:38:21.810
If you have ideas for future topics or future guests,
1097
00:38:22.550 –> 00:38:27.030
reach out to me at zneedlesatfamilybusinessmagazine.com.
1098
00:38:27.430 –> 00:38:28.050
Talk to you soon.